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	<title>Comments on: Who are you to criticise? What is the point of PR in social media?</title>
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	<link>http://www.prconversations.com/index.php/2009/02/who-are-you-to-criticise-what-is-the-point-of-pr-in-social-media/</link>
	<description>Global discussion of public relations from local perspectives</description>
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		<title>By: Trackback</title>
		<link>http://www.prconversations.com/index.php/2009/02/who-are-you-to-criticise-what-is-the-point-of-pr-in-social-media/comment-page-1/#comment-1454</link>
		<dc:creator>Trackback</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Mar 2009 16:06:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.prconversations.com/?p=526#comment-1454</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.twistimage.com/blog/archives/responding-to-the-conversation/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;Responding to the Conversation&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt; (Mitch Joel, TwistImage)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.twistimage.com/blog/archives/responding-to-the-conversation/" rel="nofollow"><em>Responding to the Conversation</em></a> (Mitch Joel, TwistImage)</p>
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		<title>By: Heather Yaxley</title>
		<link>http://www.prconversations.com/index.php/2009/02/who-are-you-to-criticise-what-is-the-point-of-pr-in-social-media/comment-page-1/#comment-1453</link>
		<dc:creator>Heather Yaxley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Feb 2009 19:52:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.prconversations.com/?p=526#comment-1453</guid>
		<description>Brandon - I totally agree with you and am still amazed when discussing social media with PR colleagues that they don&#039;t at least value its potential for research and hearing what their stakeholders/publics are saying - exactly as Kristen advises in terms of listening.

I recently wrote at www.greenbanana.wordpress.com regarding a conversation with someone who felt that PR was only relevant when dealing with intermediaries - which I find a little odd, as like you, I think the ability to communicate direct is valid and relevant to PR as we should have strong personal communication skills.

Finally, thanks Ricky - your links are interesting.  Again we seem to see a lot of so-called SM experts who don&#039;t get the point of actually joining the conversation.  Your examples are just like those customer relations folk who send you a letter or email that never actually addresses your issue.  In SM, it is simple - talk with not at.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brandon &#8211; I totally agree with you and am still amazed when discussing social media with PR colleagues that they don&#8217;t at least value its potential for research and hearing what their stakeholders/publics are saying &#8211; exactly as Kristen advises in terms of listening.</p>
<p>I recently wrote at <a href="http://www.greenbanana.wordpress.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.greenbanana.wordpress.com</a> regarding a conversation with someone who felt that PR was only relevant when dealing with intermediaries &#8211; which I find a little odd, as like you, I think the ability to communicate direct is valid and relevant to PR as we should have strong personal communication skills.</p>
<p>Finally, thanks Ricky &#8211; your links are interesting.  Again we seem to see a lot of so-called SM experts who don&#8217;t get the point of actually joining the conversation.  Your examples are just like those customer relations folk who send you a letter or email that never actually addresses your issue.  In SM, it is simple &#8211; talk with not at.</p>
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		<title>By: Kristen E. Sukalac</title>
		<link>http://www.prconversations.com/index.php/2009/02/who-are-you-to-criticise-what-is-the-point-of-pr-in-social-media/comment-page-1/#comment-1452</link>
		<dc:creator>Kristen E. Sukalac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 18:42:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.prconversations.com/?p=526#comment-1452</guid>
		<description>Heather, it was definitely not my intention to imply that you don&#039;t value a good question.  It&#039;s just a general tendency to which this medium is subject, although I have to admit that things have improved dramatically since the early days when it was all about ranting and attacking others. There are still extremists and bad eggs out there, but the general tone of conversation is much more civilized these days.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Heather, it was definitely not my intention to imply that you don&#8217;t value a good question.  It&#8217;s just a general tendency to which this medium is subject, although I have to admit that things have improved dramatically since the early days when it was all about ranting and attacking others. There are still extremists and bad eggs out there, but the general tone of conversation is much more civilized these days.</p>
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		<title>By: rickywhy</title>
		<link>http://www.prconversations.com/index.php/2009/02/who-are-you-to-criticise-what-is-the-point-of-pr-in-social-media/comment-page-1/#comment-1451</link>
		<dc:creator>rickywhy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 02:25:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.prconversations.com/?p=526#comment-1451</guid>
		<description>Here&#039;s a good way NOT to do PR in the social media: http://tinyurl.com/d4qbwe

And here&#039;s some of the philosophy behind it: http://tinyurl.com/czy6vx</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s a good way NOT to do PR in the social media: <a href="http://tinyurl.com/d4qbwe" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/d4qbwe</a></p>
<p>And here&#8217;s some of the philosophy behind it: <a href="http://tinyurl.com/czy6vx" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/czy6vx</a></p>
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		<title>By: Brandon Carlos</title>
		<link>http://www.prconversations.com/index.php/2009/02/who-are-you-to-criticise-what-is-the-point-of-pr-in-social-media/comment-page-1/#comment-1450</link>
		<dc:creator>Brandon Carlos</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 01:26:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.prconversations.com/?p=526#comment-1450</guid>
		<description>Anyone who steps into the social media space with the premise that they won&#039;t be criticized (and criticism is relative-- everyone responds to it differently, and there is such a thing as positive criticism, depending on your how you take it) has no business being here. I see it all the time, Heather; folks who post purely for the praise. The moment someone questions or criticizes--as Judy pointed out-- they&#039;re either a) no where to be found or b)on the defensive. The single most important thing an organization can do in a SM PR campaign is respond to the critics while staying on message. And yes, these campaigns are not all that different than traditional ones; we still speak and respond in key messages.

As for PR belonging here, there are some unique benefits:

1) In a field where measurement is largely anecdotal (not entirely!), social media interaction provides a campaign with much needed hard data.

2) In what other medium are organizations (or agencies, or whatever) able to converse directly with the stakeholder?

3) Free, easy, stakeholder research.

4) Because blogs and forums have brought together so many folks with like-minded interests, targeting the customer audience is sort of like fishing for a whale in a wading pool.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anyone who steps into the social media space with the premise that they won&#8217;t be criticized (and criticism is relative&#8211; everyone responds to it differently, and there is such a thing as positive criticism, depending on your how you take it) has no business being here. I see it all the time, Heather; folks who post purely for the praise. The moment someone questions or criticizes&#8211;as Judy pointed out&#8211; they&#8217;re either a) no where to be found or b)on the defensive. The single most important thing an organization can do in a SM PR campaign is respond to the critics while staying on message. And yes, these campaigns are not all that different than traditional ones; we still speak and respond in key messages.</p>
<p>As for PR belonging here, there are some unique benefits:</p>
<p>1) In a field where measurement is largely anecdotal (not entirely!), social media interaction provides a campaign with much needed hard data.</p>
<p>2) In what other medium are organizations (or agencies, or whatever) able to converse directly with the stakeholder?</p>
<p>3) Free, easy, stakeholder research.</p>
<p>4) Because blogs and forums have brought together so many folks with like-minded interests, targeting the customer audience is sort of like fishing for a whale in a wading pool.</p>
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		<title>By: Heather Yaxley</title>
		<link>http://www.prconversations.com/index.php/2009/02/who-are-you-to-criticise-what-is-the-point-of-pr-in-social-media/comment-page-1/#comment-1449</link>
		<dc:creator>Heather Yaxley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 14:36:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.prconversations.com/?p=526#comment-1449</guid>
		<description>Picking up on Toni&#039;s last point and also that of Kristen, we have the heart of this (which also relates to Judy&#039;s question).  We can choose to engage and listen to what others are saying, and indeed, should do so if we are willing to accommodate and benefit from any (constructive)criticism.  However, ultimately we will need to be responsible for our own decisions or behaviour as a result of this &quot;input&quot;.

Whether as Judy asks this means it is okay to ignore criticims, I don&#039;t know.  I was recently told by someone working for a well known brand that they&#039;d turned down a high profile radio interview which was reporting a study criticising the company&#039;s environmental activities.  As a result, the show focused entirely on another company that did accept the interview. In this case, the oxygen of negative publicity was given only to the party that engaged.

The study is still out there if anyone wants to find it - but the most important thing, I think, is that the company should have considered why it was being criticised and whether it really could be guilty of &quot;greenwashing&quot;.

BTW Kristen, I never underestimate the value of questions - most of my posts (especially those that can be seen as critical) comprise lots of questions.  Hence my personal perspective that conversation does involve listening - although I appreciate that&#039;s not true for everyone.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Picking up on Toni&#8217;s last point and also that of Kristen, we have the heart of this (which also relates to Judy&#8217;s question).  We can choose to engage and listen to what others are saying, and indeed, should do so if we are willing to accommodate and benefit from any (constructive)criticism.  However, ultimately we will need to be responsible for our own decisions or behaviour as a result of this &#8220;input&#8221;.</p>
<p>Whether as Judy asks this means it is okay to ignore criticims, I don&#8217;t know.  I was recently told by someone working for a well known brand that they&#8217;d turned down a high profile radio interview which was reporting a study criticising the company&#8217;s environmental activities.  As a result, the show focused entirely on another company that did accept the interview. In this case, the oxygen of negative publicity was given only to the party that engaged.</p>
<p>The study is still out there if anyone wants to find it &#8211; but the most important thing, I think, is that the company should have considered why it was being criticised and whether it really could be guilty of &#8220;greenwashing&#8221;.</p>
<p>BTW Kristen, I never underestimate the value of questions &#8211; most of my posts (especially those that can be seen as critical) comprise lots of questions.  Hence my personal perspective that conversation does involve listening &#8211; although I appreciate that&#8217;s not true for everyone.</p>
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		<title>By: Kristen E. Sukalac</title>
		<link>http://www.prconversations.com/index.php/2009/02/who-are-you-to-criticise-what-is-the-point-of-pr-in-social-media/comment-page-1/#comment-1448</link>
		<dc:creator>Kristen E. Sukalac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 08:18:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.prconversations.com/?p=526#comment-1448</guid>
		<description>Heather, I think we agree about &quot;informed&quot; criticism. That&#039;s what I meant about &quot;research&quot; being able to substitute for experience. A book publiished in 2007 entitled &quot;Comment parler des livres que l&#039;on n&#039;a pas lus ?&quot; (How do you talk about books you haven&#039;t read?)actually argues that critics SHOULDN&#039;T read the works they are publishing. However, non-reading in the author&#039;s (Pierre Bayard) is much wider than never opening the book.

I think it is idealistic to think that true listening is implicit in conversations. In French there is an expression &quot;dialogue des sourds&quot; (dialogue of the deaf), which means that everyone is too busy pushing their own view to listen to others. Sadly, I think this is too often true in real life and in social media. It seems to mean that most posts and comments argue one person&#039;s perspectives rather than asking questions to better understand other people&#039;s views. Anyone who has ever done any training in facilitation techniques (or psychotherapy) knows about the important of asking questions well and active listening.

And sometimes personal opinions are irrelevant. To take a more concrete example, let&#039;s look at graphic art. I have struggled in the past to reach agreement on design when the other person&#039;s judgment was based 100% on aesthetics and mine on a mixture of aethetics and communicating specific messages via the graphic art (in this case, a logo). I was willing to compromise on my aesthetic preferences in order to have a graphic object that I knew would convey a set of desired messages to target audiences. The other person wasn&#039;t involved in the relationships with those audiences, has a very well developed sense of aesthetics and therefore felt that my logo was mediocre. Yet the target audiences have reacted very positively to it. By objective measures, it has been very successful. I&#039;ll admit that I wouldn&#039;t want to frame it and hang it over my couch, but that wasn&#039;t the point.

Which brings us back to a question you raised: is the nature of the criticism subjective or objective? Because that may influence its relevance.

So yes, I think everyone has the right to their opinion, but unless we want to get mired in the total inaction that comes from trying to be all things to all people, we also have to learn when to give criticism currency and when to move on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Heather, I think we agree about &#8220;informed&#8221; criticism. That&#8217;s what I meant about &#8220;research&#8221; being able to substitute for experience. A book publiished in 2007 entitled &#8220;Comment parler des livres que l&#8217;on n&#8217;a pas lus ?&#8221; (How do you talk about books you haven&#8217;t read?)actually argues that critics SHOULDN&#8217;T read the works they are publishing. However, non-reading in the author&#8217;s (Pierre Bayard) is much wider than never opening the book.</p>
<p>I think it is idealistic to think that true listening is implicit in conversations. In French there is an expression &#8220;dialogue des sourds&#8221; (dialogue of the deaf), which means that everyone is too busy pushing their own view to listen to others. Sadly, I think this is too often true in real life and in social media. It seems to mean that most posts and comments argue one person&#8217;s perspectives rather than asking questions to better understand other people&#8217;s views. Anyone who has ever done any training in facilitation techniques (or psychotherapy) knows about the important of asking questions well and active listening.</p>
<p>And sometimes personal opinions are irrelevant. To take a more concrete example, let&#8217;s look at graphic art. I have struggled in the past to reach agreement on design when the other person&#8217;s judgment was based 100% on aesthetics and mine on a mixture of aethetics and communicating specific messages via the graphic art (in this case, a logo). I was willing to compromise on my aesthetic preferences in order to have a graphic object that I knew would convey a set of desired messages to target audiences. The other person wasn&#8217;t involved in the relationships with those audiences, has a very well developed sense of aesthetics and therefore felt that my logo was mediocre. Yet the target audiences have reacted very positively to it. By objective measures, it has been very successful. I&#8217;ll admit that I wouldn&#8217;t want to frame it and hang it over my couch, but that wasn&#8217;t the point.</p>
<p>Which brings us back to a question you raised: is the nature of the criticism subjective or objective? Because that may influence its relevance.</p>
<p>So yes, I think everyone has the right to their opinion, but unless we want to get mired in the total inaction that comes from trying to be all things to all people, we also have to learn when to give criticism currency and when to move on.</p>
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		<title>By: Judy Gombita</title>
		<link>http://www.prconversations.com/index.php/2009/02/who-are-you-to-criticise-what-is-the-point-of-pr-in-social-media/comment-page-1/#comment-1447</link>
		<dc:creator>Judy Gombita</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Feb 2009 20:24:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.prconversations.com/?p=526#comment-1447</guid>
		<description>Heather, this is a bit off topic, but I&#039;ve noticed a tendency lately in the social media realm where an &quot;active&quot; individual (i.e., active in the space) has been criticized by name, usually relating to their online behaviour, and most often the critique is done in a blog post.

In at least four cases, the individuals in question have not responded to the criticisms. Not as a comment, not as a blog post, not even as a tweet. (And we know that SM people are all into self-monitoring tools for personal and blog names, so it&#039;s not like they don&#039;t know about the criticisms.)

The lack of response has been noted by more than one person and the feeling is that s/he hopes the &quot;problem&quot; (or issue) will simply &quot;go away&quot; with time, so there&#039;s no need to address or respond, in any channel.

What&#039;s your take on this? Is it a wise or foolish strategy?

(I think this post is timely and fabulous, BTW. First three comments are informed and thought-provoking, too.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Heather, this is a bit off topic, but I&#8217;ve noticed a tendency lately in the social media realm where an &#8220;active&#8221; individual (i.e., active in the space) has been criticized by name, usually relating to their online behaviour, and most often the critique is done in a blog post.</p>
<p>In at least four cases, the individuals in question have not responded to the criticisms. Not as a comment, not as a blog post, not even as a tweet. (And we know that SM people are all into self-monitoring tools for personal and blog names, so it&#8217;s not like they don&#8217;t know about the criticisms.)</p>
<p>The lack of response has been noted by more than one person and the feeling is that s/he hopes the &#8220;problem&#8221; (or issue) will simply &#8220;go away&#8221; with time, so there&#8217;s no need to address or respond, in any channel.</p>
<p>What&#8217;s your take on this? Is it a wise or foolish strategy?</p>
<p>(I think this post is timely and fabulous, BTW. First three comments are informed and thought-provoking, too.)</p>
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		<title>By: Toni Muzi Falconi</title>
		<link>http://www.prconversations.com/index.php/2009/02/who-are-you-to-criticise-what-is-the-point-of-pr-in-social-media/comment-page-1/#comment-1446</link>
		<dc:creator>Toni Muzi Falconi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Feb 2009 17:57:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.prconversations.com/?p=526#comment-1446</guid>
		<description>Very interesting this exchange. Indeed.

If you look at the issues you raise from a generic public relations professional perspective, it goes without saying that a specific program cannot be evaluated (or even measured) if its specific objectives and indicators have not been defined and agreed upon before you take it up.

The best practices come when the organization involves potentially affected stakeholders engaging them in defining the program, its objectives and indicators before it begins.

As much as this is almost common practice today amongst the most responsible organizations as regards their sustainability programs, the extension of this practice to quote traditional unquote communication programs happens very seldom.

But of course, I know very well that your arguments refer specifically to public relations practiced in social media.

From this more specific perspective it is my opinion that not only the originator (the architect?) should listen to all criticisms (I agree with Heather on the meaning of the term), but should do everything possible to stimulate them, discuss them and learn from them.

If not, then social media (as they in fact progressively are doing) will resemble more and more the typical top down models of mainstream media and other exchange and learning forums.
It is also true that the two (social and mainstream) seem to be converging and meeting somewhere around half way.

Mind you, however, I am not advocating leaving top-down for bottom-up, btu leaving both for left-right-left, where all participants interact and exchange at the same level.

I do not think you need to be an expert to criticize, yet it is the originator of the program who ultimately decides what to absorb and what to ignore.

Here however the point is that if everything and its contrary is always public and visible to all, a program which raises initially negative comments will probably fail before its finished...but this is also true in real life, although in different ways.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very interesting this exchange. Indeed.</p>
<p>If you look at the issues you raise from a generic public relations professional perspective, it goes without saying that a specific program cannot be evaluated (or even measured) if its specific objectives and indicators have not been defined and agreed upon before you take it up.</p>
<p>The best practices come when the organization involves potentially affected stakeholders engaging them in defining the program, its objectives and indicators before it begins.</p>
<p>As much as this is almost common practice today amongst the most responsible organizations as regards their sustainability programs, the extension of this practice to quote traditional unquote communication programs happens very seldom.</p>
<p>But of course, I know very well that your arguments refer specifically to public relations practiced in social media.</p>
<p>From this more specific perspective it is my opinion that not only the originator (the architect?) should listen to all criticisms (I agree with Heather on the meaning of the term), but should do everything possible to stimulate them, discuss them and learn from them.</p>
<p>If not, then social media (as they in fact progressively are doing) will resemble more and more the typical top down models of mainstream media and other exchange and learning forums.<br />
It is also true that the two (social and mainstream) seem to be converging and meeting somewhere around half way.</p>
<p>Mind you, however, I am not advocating leaving top-down for bottom-up, btu leaving both for left-right-left, where all participants interact and exchange at the same level.</p>
<p>I do not think you need to be an expert to criticize, yet it is the originator of the program who ultimately decides what to absorb and what to ignore.</p>
<p>Here however the point is that if everything and its contrary is always public and visible to all, a program which raises initially negative comments will probably fail before its finished&#8230;but this is also true in real life, although in different ways.</p>
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		<title>By: Heather Yaxley</title>
		<link>http://www.prconversations.com/index.php/2009/02/who-are-you-to-criticise-what-is-the-point-of-pr-in-social-media/comment-page-1/#comment-1445</link>
		<dc:creator>Heather Yaxley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Feb 2009 17:15:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.prconversations.com/?p=526#comment-1445</guid>
		<description>I think criticism can be positive, negative or possibly neutral - but should always be constructive rather than destructive.

I also don&#039;t think you need do need to have walked the same ground to criticise - do you need to be a top chef, film director, artist or social media expert, to express a considered and informed critique?  They say many of the world&#039;s best coaches never reached the top of the game, and few restaurant critics are masters of the kitchen themselves.

In the case of motoring journalists, most are neither engineers nor designers (and may not even own a car or cover its running costs) - but they can explain their viewpoint in such a way that it carries weight.  Or I might prefer to rely on the criticism expressed by a bloke in the pub when buying a new car.

In the case of criticisms relating to PR in social media, either of the purposes you present are up for debate. One can certain reflect on the impact that PR has in social media, or the way in which it is practised.

In mentioning conversations and engagement, listening is implicit to me. Of course, you can simply lurk and eavesdrop on what is being said - but you could misunderstand what you hear.  Better in my view to join a discussion.

So to the heart of things - does it matter if other people think your campaign is a flop.  Well, yes and no.  Firstly, to pick up on listening, the critics may be expressing views that your audience also feels and you can learn from this.

Isn&#039;t the online discussion part of the outcome of any campaign?  It is certainly open for anyone to find and follow - so what others think can be influential.  So even if you ignore the nasty words, are your stakeholders?  And, sometimes the playground jibes have some truth in them (or they can just be childish).

Also, is it really acceptable to hype up activities in social media - or not to expect others to comment.  It doesn&#039;t mean that critics are jealous or trying to steal clients (unless you are paranoid, as some SM gurus seem to be).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think criticism can be positive, negative or possibly neutral &#8211; but should always be constructive rather than destructive.</p>
<p>I also don&#8217;t think you need do need to have walked the same ground to criticise &#8211; do you need to be a top chef, film director, artist or social media expert, to express a considered and informed critique?  They say many of the world&#8217;s best coaches never reached the top of the game, and few restaurant critics are masters of the kitchen themselves.</p>
<p>In the case of motoring journalists, most are neither engineers nor designers (and may not even own a car or cover its running costs) &#8211; but they can explain their viewpoint in such a way that it carries weight.  Or I might prefer to rely on the criticism expressed by a bloke in the pub when buying a new car.</p>
<p>In the case of criticisms relating to PR in social media, either of the purposes you present are up for debate. One can certain reflect on the impact that PR has in social media, or the way in which it is practised.</p>
<p>In mentioning conversations and engagement, listening is implicit to me. Of course, you can simply lurk and eavesdrop on what is being said &#8211; but you could misunderstand what you hear.  Better in my view to join a discussion.</p>
<p>So to the heart of things &#8211; does it matter if other people think your campaign is a flop.  Well, yes and no.  Firstly, to pick up on listening, the critics may be expressing views that your audience also feels and you can learn from this.</p>
<p>Isn&#8217;t the online discussion part of the outcome of any campaign?  It is certainly open for anyone to find and follow &#8211; so what others think can be influential.  So even if you ignore the nasty words, are your stakeholders?  And, sometimes the playground jibes have some truth in them (or they can just be childish).</p>
<p>Also, is it really acceptable to hype up activities in social media &#8211; or not to expect others to comment.  It doesn&#8217;t mean that critics are jealous or trying to steal clients (unless you are paranoid, as some SM gurus seem to be).</p>
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